SCOOP: Are awards worth it for Canadian podcasts?
A Signal Awards case study for Canadian podcasters.
Jan 22, 2024.
As Canadian podcasters navigate how to make their shows standout on the world stage, many are looking to podcast awards in hopes of growing their audiences, and gaining credibility. But most podcast awards, if not all but the Canadian Podcast Awards, are based outside of the country.
Canadian podcasters are spending thousands of USD and EUR on entering awards, attending ceremonies, and on duty fees for trophies.
So are podcast awards really worth it for Canadian podcasts?
There are a number of different podcast and audio awards out there. Each of these awards are run a little differently. Some crown their winners with the help of a judge and jury, and others use a public voting system. Some podcast awards are free to enter, most others include an entry fee which can range from $50 USD to over $1000 USD. With no real standard for awards, it’s left many people questioning the value of them and who they’re really for – especially if you podcast outside of America.
Recently, Signal Awards in particular raised some concerns for a number of Pod the North readers. So I thought it might be a good time to do a bit of a deep dive into podcast awards, using the Signal Awards as a case study.
What happened during the 2023 Signal Awards?
The Signal Awards kicked off their second year with a ton of hype in social media promotions, representation at podcast events, and some pretty enticing marketing language. “It's the largest comprehensive award for podcasting in North America,” said Signal Awards Managing Director, Deondric Royster, who recently left the role.
“It’s the most entries, as well as the most winners, and the largest judging pool out of any of the podcasting awards, as far as we're aware of that exists in North America. Those are the three main components.”
A Signal Awards spokesperson I liaised with over email told me that the Signal Awards received nearly 2000 entries in 2023. Among its 107 categories (I counted), there were 600 winners (again, I counted). Some quick math shows that there was an average of 5.6 winners per category.
The Signal Awards culminated in a Manhattan-based Signal Award Winners Party on October 23, 2023, at The Bowery Hotel.
Winning a Signal Award isn’t cheap for Canadian podcasters, but it’s easy enough to try.
Early bird entry fees for the second annual Signal Awards started at $225 USD and ran up to $795 USD, depending on the category. Some back-of-the-envelope calculations concluded that on the winners alone, the Signal Awards raked in just over $153,000 USD – and that’s assuming winners paid the early bird entry fee.
For Canadians in particular, entry fees have been a bit of a splurge. With the notable amount of winners and categories, the volume of money coming in for Signal Awards is something Canadian podcasters have started to look at with a critical eye.
“Starting from submission, it immediately felt money grabby,” one Canadian podcast entity told me, who asked to stay anonymous. “They had so many categories[…] And then there were all these little add ons and stuff. Why do you need $500 USD to simply nominate yourself?”
The folks at indie podcast, Human-B-Gone (who won Bronze in Sound Design), told me they spent $1000 USD out of pocket on their submissions. For the popular Canadian podcast network, Canadaland, the entry fees for Signal Awards were “enough so that it was prohibitive to submit arbitrarily,” said COO, Alan Black. The Canadaland team won Gold in Sports: Documentary for their season of Commons: Hockey.
Despite the somewhat exclusive entry-fees and impressive range of industry talent in the judging pool, submitting to the Signal Awards was still strikingly simple. Submissions mostly consisted of a podcast’s general contact info, the link to the podcast or particular episode, and selection of their category. “[Submitting] was easier than most,” said the folks at Human-B-Gone. “It was maybe too easy,” said Alan Black, “I don't remember it being laborious.”
Some podcasters, including Chidinma Azubuike whose podcast But What Do I Know? won Bronze in Education, received emails inviting them to submit to the awards. “I was told ‘we think that your work is good’, so that was one of the reasons that I applied. I felt like if you're telling me that you really do love the work that I'm doing, that at least I would be nominated. I didn't think that it would mean that I would win.”
In the invitation to apply, Azubuike also received a code – not a discount code for the entry fee, but a tracking code. She read the email to me; “‘if you decide to apply, please use code 2ECP so we can track your entry through the process’.”
I asked Royster about what the codes were about, but he couldn’t say exactly; “I've never heard of that. We most definitely do outreach for potential candidates to win awards. We just haven't incorporated tracking in terms of that. Maybe there's a new component to it now that I'm not aware of but at least my time definitely didn't add that component in.”
So who knows what’s up with those tracking codes.
Uncertainty around crowning winners.
How the winners of the Signal Awards are crowned was another point of contention for Canadian podcasters, with many claiming a lack of transparency.
“It was so unclear about what was happening, and we researched and we emailed them,” said an anonymous source, “there [are] judges, but then also [Signal Awards] are trying to get people to vote. We didn't know how the voting works, or what the criteria is… It’s not explained anywhere on the site. We emailed them; no response.”
When the Signal Awards winners were announced, many people were surprised to discover that there were sometimes up to 12 winners in a category, and multiple Gold, Silver and Bronze winners in the majority of their 107 categories.
Some categories were filled with mostly Gold winners:
Some categories had no Gold winners at all:
And some podcasts, despite being the only finalist in their category, still only took home the Bronze.
No where in the submission process or on the Signal Awards website was the process for selecting winners articulately explained. The process for determining winners felt “ totally opaque,” said the folks at Human-B-Gone.
Deondric Royster explained to me how Signal Awards are given out based on a combination of a judging system and public voting system. “The way that winners are picked is our judges. We have [them] judge based off three main pillars. Each judge picks the category that they feel most capable of judging to their best knowledge. Some people will pick two to three different categories that they feel most strongly about. You judge them based off the criteria that we extend to them [...] basically we're going off like the technical aspect of it, then there's craft questions, and then there's quality questions [...] and basically an average score [is] computed, and that's how you see the rendering of the winners.”
Gold, Silver and Bronze winners are determined by where an average score ranks. “You're not essentially head-to-head against other podcasters in that category. So where there could be a category that has a Silver winner and multiple Bronze winners, essentially your average score from those judges are tallied and averaged out to what level of winner you are.”
I talked to Lauren Passell, one of the 2023 Signal Awards judges, who told me that she also wasn’t certain how judging ultimately impacted how winners were selected, or if judging results might be impacted by voting.
Judges were asked to judge podcasts over a designated web portal. “It was like, ‘start’, ‘click here’. And then it would randomly spit them through,” Lauren told me. “You have to judge at least 60 – listening and adding notes – and you had to identify ‘is there any conflict here?’. “They didn't really explain what the numbers mean. It was just on a scale that I was kind of like, am I doing this right?”
Once the average scores come in from the judges, the winners have essentially been selected, but they don’t know it until after everything goes through the public vote. This determines the “Listeners Choice” winner. “We open it up to the public, they campaign for themselves or we campaign on behalf of Signal,” said Royster..
“I don't know if [winners] were picked by voting, or is that partially just a brilliant social media play on their part,” said Human-B-Gone, “but we certainly played along – definitely posted and asked people to vote.”
Whether or not it is a brilliant social media play, the Signal Awards have certainly made it very easy for winners to spread the Signal Awards brand, with the “Resources” page on their website including a number of ways to do so.
Canadian podcasters are wondering where their entry fees are going.
This year there were 177 judges listed on the Signal Awards website. The roster of judges listed a ton of big names from across the industry and around the world, including Anna Hossnieh (iHeartRadio), Lisa Wisniewski (CBC) and Karen Whitehouse (WHO SHAT ON THE FLOOR AT MY WEDDING?). That’s pretty much all anyone who wasn’t a judge knew about judging.
I talked to one podcast industry veteran, who has judged numerous audio awards and asked to stay anonymous, and they told me that listing judges on an awards website isn’t exactly a standard practice. “Normally you shouldn't be able to tell people that you are a judge until the awards have actually been announced. The judges are [a] secret.”
Many Canadian podcasters assumed that entry fees played a part in compensating judges for their time, which for the Signal Awards was not the case.
“Right now it's just volunteer based”, said Deondric, “which to me is the coolest part because I'm all for paying people for their time but as of now, I think it's incredible because these people are just doing it because they love podcasts and because they love the industry, and they want to see it genuinely move forward in a positive direction.”
As a judge, Lauren Passell told me that she ended up spending “hours and hours” judging. Descript’s Arielle Nissenblatt, was also a judge last year, told me she “spent about 10 hours listening to the audio and sharing thoughts. I could have spent more!” Judges did however receive invitations to the Winners Party.
The second annual Signal Awards Winners Party was free to attend, and described by an anonymous source as a “big event space, sprawling multiple rooms, free food, open bar, people walking around handing out champagne glasses. This big outdoor patio, beautiful space. There was a very brief announcement… a quick thank you. And then a long talk about the company that won Company of the Year; Audible. Then they played a video about audible… It was probably like five to 10 minutes max.”
“Essentially we got to a point where these companies like Apple and Pineapple Street, all these big brands were submitting – they have like 15 [entries], 20, 25 and Audible submitted about 40 ish, maybe 50 ish podcasts. So they were the company that had the most winners consequently. So obviously it's a volume thing but also the quality of podcasts that they submitted were just incredible,” Royster explained to me. “We wanted to create a staple award that was unique to Signal. It's an award, but it's also a commemoration of the moment.”
After the Signal Award winners were announced online, they were also invited to check out the Signal Awards online store, where they could order their trophies. “I thought I had already paid to apply, and part of that would also go to buying the award," said Chidinma Azubuike (But What Do I Know?). “When I ordered the award and the certificate, I think that was also $250, so in total I spent about $500 on this whole ordeal.”
“I got a UPS tracking on my email from New Jersey and I'm thinking ‘maybe it's the award that's coming in today’. Then UPS was calling me that the sender did not put themselves as the broker to clear that custom, so those fees were on me. It was about $20 to have UPS be a broker for me, and then another $30 or so to actually clear the duties fees and all of that.”
Despite Signal Awards being inclusive of internationally-based judges, the process of awarding international winners is still getting sorted out to the detriment of Canadian podcasters with small awards budgets. “Those are aspects we were actively ironing out in real time. It was an unexpected success and achievement to have winners abroad. We really didn't think anyone outside of the United States really would probably be winners. As a Managing Director, it's a good feeling, but it's also daunting at the same time because I didn't plan for this. We really were thinking that first year that most of our winners would be US based, if not all of them.”
Getting this perspective is pretty humbling as a Canadian podcaster, at least for myself. It tells me that the Canadian podcasting industry still isn’t seen as a major player.
Big price tags on awards means Canadian podcasters are getting more intentional about entries.
So what does it mean to be a Signal Award winner?
Outside of the doubts surrounding “paying to play” in the US podcasting industry, some other concerns around the Signal Awards was a general sense of mystery around where they came from. The Signal Awards website doesn’t have a “Team” page, and their “About” page is fairly vague.
“I don't know any of the folks who put the awards together, they just seemed to come from nowhere,” said one anonymous international podcaster. “And that's fine, we all need to start somewhere. But we've just had the Ambies for the Podcast Academy – or as my co host calls [them], the American Podcast Awards. We had the iHeart Podcast Awards, which I don't think are particularly helpful in terms of big podcast awards for the industry. And then all of a sudden the Signal Awards appear.”
Podcasters got particularly curious when they started to receive mailers advertising other events and awards ceremonies. “I did start getting mailings after I submitted,” said Alan Black (Canadaland). “When we filled out the forms, we put the address of my home,” said an anonymous source, “immediately after that happened, I started getting tons of letters all for different awards.” This source showed me one of the mailers they received, it was for the Telly Awards.
“Shortly after I won, I got a mailer to my house for another award called the Communicator Awards,” said Chidinma Azubuike (But What Do I Know?), “they gave me a code as well, and I realized they work out of the same office as the Signal Awards.”
The shared corporate office between each of these events led me to find Recognition Media, a large producer of media and entertainment awards shows.
The Telly Awards and Communicator Awards are indeed run by Recognition Media, also known as Webby Media Group. Recognition Media/ Webby Media Group also run the more well known, Webby Awards – who’ve notably received criticism in the past – and the European-based, Lovie Awards.
The Recognition Media website doesn’t explicitly list its award shows, with them only really mentioned in a carousel of testimonials from US publications like The New York Times, The Washington Times and Hollywood reporter, on the “About” page.
Recognition Media, a nearly 20 year old company, was co-founded by Neil Vogel, and Rodger Berman, the latter being the husband of American celebrity wardrobe stylist and former TV star, Rachel Zoe. According to Berman’s LinkedIn, he left Recognition Media in 2009 and has basically been working on his wife’s fashion empire ever since. Vogel still sits on the Board of Directors for Webby Media Group (Recognition Media), a portfolio company of Salem Capital.
“[Signal Awards] is an extension of all of the other amazing awards that are underneath the recognition media umbrella,” said Royster. “When it came to Signal, we had three to four dedicated people, but we also had people who were a part of different award properties, so probably a total of about 10 or 12 people. I managed that team. We basically come up with all of the creative for it, I would come up with themes, also onboard judges. We can host events, spread the word. I would tally the votes, help at least tally the votes. I managed literally every aspect of Signal from a day to day basis, from sunup to sundown.”
Royster shared the news about his departure with me just as a job listing for a “General Manager of Signal Awards” popped up on the Recognition Media website the week of January 8th. It’s since been taken down. The job is a full-time, hybrid role, based in their NYC Flatiron office, and includes a 100K USD salary, benefits and a “generous incentive-based bonus program”.
“It was an amicable decision between myself and Signal,” Royster said about leaving the awards. “One of the things that I would like to do is building a platform where we can onboard creators. I think having an incubator or creative bed for them to use as a platform and monetize their brand.”
At nearly 2000 entries starting a $225 USD, the Signal Awards brought in $450,000 USD last year.
In the same year, The Webby Awards received nearly 14,000 entries at $496 USD for regular entry, bringing in somewhere around $693,000 USD. The Webbys extended deadline is still currently open for this year's awards from Dec 2023 to February 2024 at $525 USD.
The recent Telly Awards saw 12,000 entries with fees starting at $185 USD on the lowest end, bringing in at least $222,0000 USD for Recognition Media.
Each series of awards from Recognition Media is accompanied by an awards show or party, the Webbys being their most extravagant.
“Throughout the venue there were TV screens cycling through the artwork of podcast award winners as folks waited for theirs to appear on screen for a photo,” said an anonymous source about the Signal Awards Winners Party. “As we were talking to people, it became clear that everyone knows we paid the money , we won an award, and we got to come here. You're just basically buying an award… that doesn't mean you have a good podcast”.
I reached out to Recognition Media and many of their team members to give them an opportunity to respond to my findings, but they did not provide any commentary.
Canadian podcasters are wondering what the value of a podcast award is.
Canadaland’s Alan Black started his career in filmmaking, and for many years was a part of the awards circuit. “I've won some awards for my films and you get laurels, you get a trophy, you get some recognition. But I question how much value there is in the actual awards outside of ‘look, mom, I won an award’.
“When you think about the big awards, there's campaigning, people put in millions of dollars into marketing for an Oscar campaign, and there's people getting out on the circuit. At a film festival, the jury is flown in and wined and dined. You wouldn't pay for your statue, that's for sure. If you win, you win, you get a statue, that's what you get for winning. It's not an added charge.”
Regardless of the different podcast awards out there, unlike the Oscars and Emmys, podcasts awards are mainly recognized by podcasters rather than podcast audiences.
“I imagine there's much more value in being on the Vulture's Top Ten list than there is winning an award at this point,” said Black, “I think in an ideal world there'd be an award that had meaning outside of the podcast industry”.
While it might mean impressive credentials to share with advertisers, podcast award wins still don’t mean much to podcast audiences.
“[Winning] helped one of my clients get a little bit of attention,” said Lauren Passell, who runs Tink Media, a podcast growth company. “She has a cannabis podcast for women and as soon as she won, cannabis companies started talking to her more.”
“Winning awards is certainly helpful as a selling point in talking to brands and agencies,” said Bob Kane, Country Manager for Canada at Libsyn’s AdvertiseCast, “but Audience is the closer, almost always.”
“We certainly didn't blow up because of [the award win], there wasn't any massive spike,” said Human-B-Gone, “I don't believe the awards are a way to get numbers. I think it's a way to get creators to collaborate with. I think I would probably [enter] again, just because the people that I want to impress perceive that the Signal Awards have some merit.”
“Let's say we have $2,000 to spend a year. Should we spend on awards where we think we'll win? Or should we spend it on awards that are the best awards to win?” said Black on behalf of Canadaland. “As we look at our budget for 2024, we now have a trophy on our trophy shelf and I think that people here at Canadaland would be more interested in winning a CAJ award, because it means something when they walk into a room of journalists here in Canada. They don't spend a lot of time around podcasters.”
For some Canadian podcasters, the Signal Awards weren’t worth it. “Do I want to give the Signal Awards hundreds and hundreds of American dollars again in order to just say we got an award and go to New York?” said an anonymous Canadian podcast entity, “Probably not. I don't see the return on investment on this.”
“I'm an independent podcaster, I am making my budget for the podcast next year and because I'm doing a rebrand, I'm going to be spending a lot of money on the rebrand,” said Chidinma Azubuike (But What Do I Know?). “I've won it, it's cool, I don't think it's something I'm gonna prioritize every year moving forward.”
“At the end of the day, these are businesses,” one podcast industry reporter told me. “If you run a business as an award ceremony, then it's gonna pay its way somewhere. The reality is some award ceremonies are shams, and some award ceremonies are literally there for you to pay to enter. Others are really good. Are they there to benefit the industry or are they there because they think that there's money in this?”
“It's so fucking hard to make things and it's so hard to get recognized for anything if you're an independent creator,” said Alan Black. “ If [an award win] keeps you going a little bit longer, maybe that ultimately is the value. You're paying for a feeling that you're part of a community, that people care about what you're doing.
Thank you Skye Pillsbury at The Squeeze for her editorial support on this piece.
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Kattie
@Podkatt (Twitter, Spotify, and Goodpods) | @ PodtheNorth (Bluesky)
Awards are an incredible racket, really benefitting the organisers beyond anyone else. And they only have any significance if we act like they do, so I'd rather we found better ways to celebrate good work, and stopped entering awards and thus funding these rotten orgs.
Thanks for this deep dive, Kattie! Wanted to flag that the Quill Podcasts Awards are both free and organized by Canadians! https://www.quillpodcasting.com/qpa/quill-podcast-awards